Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

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Fitz2380
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by Fitz2380 »

Thanks for the response and the link to the other post. I had seen that post at one time as I see I replied to someone in that post as well. I believe I was not using or far enough along with Deepstack at that time. However, your information is spot on. Now I understand what I am seeing when I analyze the BVR vs the DAT file and it makes sense as least the way you describe.

I am analyzing a couple of issues. One that was similar to yours noted above with the FedEX truck and I think I may have solved this one using the information that you provided. My other issue is more a inconvenience as I keep getting DS analyzed alerts for stationary vehicles at night. Lights coming around the corner trigger the motion and DS sees my parked truck and alerts. I am not sure why it does not see it as stationary and ignore it.
On the other hand I have a container on my front porch that DS keeps seeing and identifies it as a toilet..... And no I don't have a toilet on my front porch...
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YrbkMgr
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by YrbkMgr »

Fitz2380 wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 7:47 pm Thanks for the response and the link to the other post. I had seen that post at one time as I see I replied to someone in that post as well. I believe I was not using or far enough along with Deepstack at that time. However, your information is spot on. Now I understand what I am seeing when I analyze the BVR vs the DAT file and it makes sense as least the way you describe.

I am analyzing a couple of issues. One that was similar to yours noted above with the FedEX truck and I think I may have solved this one using the information that you provided. My other issue is more a inconvenience as I keep getting DS analyzed alerts for stationary vehicles at night. Lights coming around the corner trigger the motion and DS sees my parked truck and alerts. I am not sure why it does not see it as stationary and ignore it.
On the other hand I have a container on my front porch that DS keeps seeing and identifies it as a toilet..... And no I don't have a toilet on my front porch...
I'm pleased that the information I provided helped. In regards to the stationary vehicles and headlight triggers... a little more detail on what's happening would be helpful - specifically, are the stationary vehicles triggering an alert notification such as sms, email, alarm, whathaveyou? Or are you finding that the headlights trigger the camera to record?

So I'm asking if, in the clips list, filtered by Alerts, you're seeing confirmed alerts that should have been cancelled by DS. The following is an example of the clips list filtered by Alerts showing confirmed and cancelled alerts.
Clips List.jpg
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Myself, I stopped using stationary objects, and I don't give a horses petute about how many recordings are made because Clips and Archiving takes care of that for me. I am focused on legit alert notifications - that's me.

With the above in mind, maybe a better way to frame this is... what would you like to happen that is not happening, or conversely, what's happening that you don't want to happen?

The toilet... the same happens to me from time to time and only becomes an issue when DS incorrectly recognizes an object that it should confirm but doesn't - if you want Box identified and it's calling it a toilet, then it's an issue. See the example about the horse and dog I mentioned in the previous post. Other than that, I don't really care what DS recognizes as long as my "To Confirm" objects are correctly identified.

A critical aspect of DS "tuning" is to make sure that the camera's Record Tab --> Pre-Trigger Video Buffer is at least 5 seconds so as to allow enough data for DS to analyze for object recognition. Also, with the DS status window open, Ctrl+Dbl Click on a clip loads the clip and pauses it at the triggering event. The DS status window will show yellow rectangles where it thought there was motion. This aspect reveals the synchronization - between BI and DS and is a clue to making sure DS is seeing motion when BI does - mostly camera settings.
BI Recording Tab Pre-rigger Buffer_sm.JPG
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DS Motion Rectangle vs Object_sm.JPG
DS Motion Rectangle vs Object_sm.JPG (56.58 KiB) Viewed 2239 times
  • "Whenever I take something apart to fix it and put it back together again, I end up with like six really important looking pieces left over" -Tim Allen
  • If you know what your after, you'll recognize it when you see it.
Fitz2380
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:59 pm

Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by Fitz2380 »

I think the toilet identification is funny and was going to make a joke about having a toilet on my front porch but didn't want to offend anyone....

My focus is to minimize false alerts so I am using Deep Stack to analyze triggered motion and 'trigger' the alert. I have a NVR that is recording 24x7 all cameras so if I need to I can always go to the NVR if I should miss an alert/recording.

I do use a Pre-trigger video buffer and have this set for 8 seconds in the example below. This is the headlight issue that I mentioned. The headlights trigger the motion as they move across the yard and the house. DS analyzes and results in the alert as shown. My thinking is that the headlights on the object must cause DS to think the object is moving.

The two images were opened with CTRL- Double Click on the alert. I included camera settings as well.
Attachments
Record Settings.JPG
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DS Window.JPG
DS Window.JPG (74.57 KiB) Viewed 2238 times
Camera Windows.JPG
Camera Windows.JPG (159.25 KiB) Viewed 2238 times
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YrbkMgr
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by YrbkMgr »

DS analyzes and results in the alert as shown. My thinking is that the headlights on the object must cause DS to think the object is moving.
Consider this. When the headlights trigger the camera, recording starts, DS analyzes the video. If DS recognizes an object that's in the "to confirm" box, the alert proceeds. My point is, the recording will always take place with headlights moving across the lawn unless you change the sensitivity of the motion sensor at night. I have the exact same thing - headlights trigger recording. But DS keeps false alerts from annoying me. Sh*t-ton of recordings, but I'm not notified.

In the image you posted DS thinks the cooler is a car. If "car" is in the confirm box, it will trigger a false alert. If your issue is that you are getting alert notifications due to false positives (cooler), there are a couple ways to deal with it. But it's not clear to me that's what's happening. If it is, you can mask out the cooler (Zone A), create a night profile that doesn't have "car" in the confirm box, and a few other ways. But looking at your front door area, I can't see a reason you would want to be alerted when DS identifies a car at night. To my way of thinking, I'd be focusing on being alerted at night when there's a person identified.
  • "Whenever I take something apart to fix it and put it back together again, I end up with like six really important looking pieces left over" -Tim Allen
  • If you know what your after, you'll recognize it when you see it.
Fitz2380
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Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:59 pm

Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by Fitz2380 »

So I will try your suggestion of masking out the cooler... to see if that changes things. My thought was since there was not motion of the cooler that DS should ignore it as I have the "Detect/ignore static objects" selected. However, maybe this feature does not work the way that I think it should as I have seen similar alerts when a vehicle is sitting in my driveway as well.

Yeah my intent was to alert on a car or person coming up the driveway but could play around with that some more. I don't think I can ever get 'perfect' alerting, but I never like to give up.
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YrbkMgr
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by YrbkMgr »

Looking at your surveillance area in the photo, I can't see how alerting you on a car does any good until a person gets out. I had a similar issue at the back of my place and it was driving me nutz. So I decided that what I cared about was if there was a person. I'm not saying it's right for you, but I know it's easy to get mission creep when you can do all kinds of fancy things with BI.

Do I care: Nice to know, but not critical
Garage.20210918_234820350.18-b.jpg
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Alert Me:
Garage.20211121_183850780.39_sm.jpg
Garage.20211121_183850780.39_sm.jpg (67.34 KiB) Viewed 2219 times
  • "Whenever I take something apart to fix it and put it back together again, I end up with like six really important looking pieces left over" -Tim Allen
  • If you know what your after, you'll recognize it when you see it.
Fitz2380
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:59 pm

Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by Fitz2380 »

You have a valid point on what is the goal I am trying to achieve. I am very myopic so I need to step back sometimes. I do have a question with how DS analyzes static objects though. I wonder what its algorithm is?? If DS analyzes the images sent to it and alerts on the first confirmation, does it then analyze the remaining images and then cancel the alert if it determines that the object has not moved??

Thanks for all your insight..Much appreciated.
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YrbkMgr
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by YrbkMgr »

Hey man, you're not alone - I always have to reel myself in and go back to Form Follows Function mode (Frank Lloyd Wright). There are lots of cool things that I try to make BI do and can't - then I think about this: What do I really need? Here's an example of how I try to manage mission creep...

I live in a two-flat built in 1919. Front screened in porch, doorbells don't work. I put the camera in service to let me know if someone was on my porch.
BI Porch Master_sm.JPG
BI Porch Master_sm.JPG (76.28 KiB) Viewed 2216 times
That's the mission critical function for me. Everything else is "nice to have". I live on the first floor. The windows on the right in the photo are my living room. So you can see that's a security vulnerability. I'm not worried about someone robbing me - sh*t happens in life. MY concern is a breach when I'm home. That's the most important thing for me. It is not my goal to bring anything to the police - my goal is to be notified and thus prepared for an immediate threat. The way I think about it is, I can't stop a robbery and if I get video... yay for me. But my main concern is if there's an intruder while I'm home. As long as I keep to "what are your goals?", it makes my life easier. Just sharing one perspective.

As it relates to stationary objects, there are a couple of videos that address it from the Self Help section of this forum. One is The DeepStack Analysis Feature, and another is The Viewer window and motion fine-tuning

I see "stationary object" as beneficial if it's a parking lot situation. To be honest, I've enabled stationary object detection a couple of times in the past, but turned it off. Because again, I only need alerts on people - it'll still record the activity, but only alert me when I need it. If you remove car from DS (confirm) also, you don't have to mask anything.
  • "Whenever I take something apart to fix it and put it back together again, I end up with like six really important looking pieces left over" -Tim Allen
  • If you know what your after, you'll recognize it when you see it.
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YrbkMgr
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Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by YrbkMgr »

There's a new post referencing "Occupied State" (stationary objects) From BI here: DeepStack user experience
  • "Whenever I take something apart to fix it and put it back together again, I end up with like six really important looking pieces left over" -Tim Allen
  • If you know what your after, you'll recognize it when you see it.
Fitz2380
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Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:59 pm

Re: Test and Tune Motion and Deep Stack Review Orange Frame

Post by Fitz2380 »

Thanks for the heads up. Interesting information on the 'occupied state'.
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